“Extreme” Times Right Now, Worse than 1970s, Dollar Collapse is Next

“Extreme” Times Right Now, Worse than 1970s, Dollar Collapse is Next

talk to me about gold gold is the form of money that has held its value for 3,000 years and it’s the uh the money that people jump back into when their country tries a different kind of money and that money fails you know you can use gold to back your currency without making a political statement without choosing sides in in the world’s geopolitical turmo with the dollar you’re kind of choosing sides now the the US has taken its currency from a a neutral Reserve asset and they turned to something where you know you’re for us or you’re against [Music] us he’s the author of The Coming collapse of the dollar and money bubble he also has his own substack which uh thousands of people follow please welcome to the Danel kamboni show John Rubino John so nice to finally meet you have you on the show welcome welcome welcome Hey Daniela it is it’s nice to meet you thanks you know I I always say it’s fascinating John uh because we’ve both been in the gold uh sector for so long and I think I just when I think I’ve met everyone uh in it uh just today I was saying wait how could it be that we haven’t met in person yet and I’m sure we’ll get to that one day but for now we’ll we’ll take this show today yeah well better late than never and I’ve been a fan of yours for a long time time so it’s nice to meet yeah well I appreciate that and I thought the timing was perfect uh because we have uh news that came out over the weekend uh that Trump advisers are discussing penalties for Nations that move away from the dollar this is an article from Bloomberg uh which says former president Donald Trump’s economic advisers are considering ways to actively stop nations from shifting away from using the dollar an effort to counter budding moves among key Emerging Markets to reduce exposure to the US currency this is according to people familiar with the matter so look you wrote a book on the dollar collapse over 20 years ago so I thought you’d be a perfect person to ask about this I mean he’s not in office yet they’re obviously preparing for a victory here and they’re obviously looking at the fact that the dollar could be threatened by Concepts such as the bricks well see this is how Empires think right they they assume they have basically the right to rule and anybody who um who deviates from the Empire’s line is automatically some kind of criminal but I think what the guys in charge don’t seem to recognize is that the reason other countries are moving away from using the dollar for trade and for Reserve assets is that we’ve been abusing the privilege of having the world’s Reserve currency for a really long time now and it’s getting worse um you know if anybody steps out of line we threaten to kick them out of this Swift International Bank settlement system or we sanction their products whatever they’re trying to sell make it harder for them to operate um globally and uh and we do that without regard apparently for how it makes these other countries feel you know a lot of countries would just like to be out from under dollar hemony and they’re taking steps some some countries are um cutting bilateral trade deals where they trade with each other in each other’s currencies and other countries are buying a lot of gold with the you know the maybe the expectation of U backing their own currencies with gold at some point and you mentioned the bricks and that’s that’s a very loose organization of people who really wish the US would stop picking on them and they’re making noises like they’re going to create a currency that is maybe backed by gold and and operates independent of the US dollar for world trade and and these are all trends that are in place and they’re all bad for the dollar going forward and they won’t be fixed by the US treating countries who want to trade in their own currencies like criminals so I I think these Trends have legs and it’s going to go on for a really long time and it’s going to continue to move in the direction that hurts the dollars exchange rate and it’s use as a trade currency and its use as a reserve asset you know it’s it’s going in a negative d direction for the dollar and we’re not doing anything to fix that that makes any sense right now no uh very interesting points I mean um like to your point the discussions include penalties for allies or adversaries who seek active ways to engage in bilateral trade and currencies other uh than the dollar but if we look at uh the status of the dollar today every major currency in the world has fallen against the US dollar this year an unusually broad shift with the potential for serious consequences across the global economy uh this is an article from The Wall Street Journal that says two-thirds of the roughly 150 currencies tracked by Bloomberg have weakened against the dollar whose recent strength stems from a shift in expectations about when and by how much the FED may cut its Benchmark interest rate which sits at around a 20-year high so the dollar uh is still the best in the world John oh yeah it still res Remains the world’s Reserve currency and this is one of the kind of um funny aspects of um a reserve currency you know a lot of debt is denominated in dollars out there and a lot of countries hold dollars as Reserve assets still um and the US is still seen as kind of the Safe Haven Country so when there’s trouble in the world even if we cause the trouble Capital flows into the us and it it uh keeps the dollar strong relative to other currencies CES but um relative to other currencies isn’t really the best way to measure the strength of a currency you should look at the purchasing power of that currency right and the US dollar lost almost 10% of its purchasing power in 20122 it was like 8.75% um official and the real number was probably more like 15% so if all the world’s Fiat currencies are falling because they’re all mismanaged because it’s a flawed concept to be with um and one currency is falling a little more slowly than the other currencies it looks like it’s strong but only if you compare it to a bunch of other crappy Fiat currencies that are falling in value so um thinking of the the US dollar as a strong currency because it’s up against the Euro or the Yen um gives you a false sense of perspective so look at it in terms of pering power right absolutely valid point but pain to me how does the path look like of the destruction of the US dollar I mean how does it get to the point where all of a sudden it’s self-destructing because folks may say look John you wrote that book The Coming collapse of the dollar 20 years ago right um’s still here now you might say well 20 years is not a long time for it to fail empir take you know could take centuries what not but the point is it’s still it’s still strong right yes well the two point important points from this one is never come to me with questions about timing because I clearly am not good at predicting what’s gonna happen in the short run you know so let’s let’s not do the what’s gonna happen in the next six months yeah um but the other thing is that um the the world’s currencies the big ones anyhow the Euro and the Yen and the dollar and pound sterling are all depreciating at now at an accelerating rate you know they’re always they’re all losing value and the amount of debt that these countries are taking on is going parabolic so we’re kind of at the end game here now here I go again predicting uh something that has to do with timing but we we are getting to the point where for instance the Federal Reserve all the other central banks are in the same boat with the FED uh in particular is in a box that it it really can’t get out of because we’ve taken on so much debt over the last 20 years that we’re in a place now where um inflation is rising and interest rates are rising so if the FED addresses inflation by raising interest rates even further from here it bankrupts a big chunk of the global speculating Community which is to say most of the world now in other words housing and Commercial Real Estate and local banks they’re they they’re all potentially blown up by higher interest rates but if you fed If the Fed addresses the effects of higher interest rates by pushing interest rates down then it’s going to cause inflation to start rising at an even faster rate than it’s been rising lately and that’s devastating for a financialized economy so we we’re at the point now that seemed like it was going to come a lot sooner you know I literally expected um 2008 or so to be basically the end of the fiat currency experiment and and that didn’t happen we were able to um to buy ourselves another decade by taking on immense amounts of new debt but finally those debts are starting to bite in ways that we don’t have any answer for um so I think you know Japan might go first because they’ve got so much government debt that they can’t let their interest rates go up at the same time the yen is plunging even versus the dollar but also in terms of purchasing power and so they’re stuck too so we’re I think the story of the next few years is going to be central banks having to make decisions about which kind of Crisis they going to bring on by trying to fix other problems uh and there’s not going to be a solution for it so at some point you know now I’m not going name a date here but at some point it um it Dawns on the world with the central banks with their Fiat currencies just can’t fix the problems that are mounting out there and then I think the markets react U by front running for instance um higher inflation and that is basically the end game for these currencies um I want to get back to the Yen but just to get back to um the article citing you know potential punishments for for for countries that deviate away from the US dollar um you you’re saying that’s bad policy and it will eventually you know turn around and and um bite you so you’re saying if those are the playing cards of the United States right that they’re going to threaten penalties if you diverge from the US dollar if you dump the dollar you’re saying that can’t that’s not going to work for a long-term strategy can you just elaborate on that why wouldn’t it work why wouldn’t penalties from the strongest country in the world right the superpower of the world why couldn’t that be the solution to hang on to Dollar dominance because other countries do have things they can do you know the US is definitely the most powerful country in the World financially and militarily um but it’s not like countries other countries are are slaves or anything you know they are able to cut um trade deals with each other that just bypass the dollar they’re able to accumulate lots of gold which is what’s happening right now you know foreign central banks are massive buyers of gold in the last couple of years they bought a thousand tons of gold in each of the past two years um and the more gold they own the better able they are to back their currencies with gold if that’s what it comes to so they’re gaining tools that allow them to bypass the dollar and yeah yeah it’s not something they can just flip a switch with or anything they can’t just do it today but they can move in that direction a little bit at a time and the reason it’s gold that they’re buying and not you know Bitcoin or oil or or other things like that is that um gold is the form of money that tradition backed currencies back when we had legitimate currencies instead of just these Fiat things that are backed by nothing um and gold is neutral you know you can use gold to back your currency without making a political statement without choosing sides in in the world’s geopolitical turmoils um with the dollar you’re kind of choosing sides now the the US has taken its currency from a a neutral Reserve asset where it’s it is just what it is and you don’t have to choose sides by buying dollars and they turned it into something where you know you’re for us or you’re against us when you manage your foreign exchange reserves and you know nobody wants to be put in that position and nobody you know a growing number of countries don’t really want to be on our side on a lot of big Global issues so that’s why um China Russia India and a lot of other countries are building up such big gold reserves now and they’re continuing to buy and that that basically means two things it means one there’s a lot of of upward price pressure on gold now because you got these whales in the market that didn’t used to be there but they’re continuously buying gold and they’re not very price sensitive they just you know they want it for the long term so they’re they’re not going to sell if gold goes up $100 an ounce you’re not going to see China dump a bunch of their gold and book a short-term profit or anything these are very strong hands where go is going um and then at the same time well anyhow um that gives them a growing ability to back their currency with gold if they want to and that’s not a um that’s not an anti- us statement as much as it is a statement of neutrality in other words okay our our currency is now backed by gold so we’re not on anybody’s side we’re just trying to manage our currency so leave us alone yeah yeah I I like that uh I like that thought process that makes that makes a lot of sense because what I found interesting is how vocal um China has been in regards to their gold purchases I mean you’ll remember John years of radio Silence from China I mean like I say they don’t need to you don’t have to do the reporting you know they everything that’s mined in China is kept in China um but they’re being so vocal and I found that interesting that you know every month they’re coming out saying oh we bought we bought more gold we bought more gold they want the world to know they’re buying gold yeah that’s that’s a sign of confidence you know they they think they can manage their own currency now and that the US can’t do that much about it anymore and and I think it’s kind of a solidarity thing with the rest of the bricks they’re they’re kind of leading away and saying look look what we did we bought you know thousands of tons of gold and you can too and then at some point may maybe we set up that currency set up a gold back trading currency um that we use with each other and then we don’t have to worry about you know whether the rupe is going to hold its value and what we can do with it if we have a bunch of rubles or whatever we’ve got this currency that we all understand that’s backed by gold it holds at Value and we use it to trade with each other so China is kind of signaling that um that is now a prospect and and it is it’s not a short-term Prospect but it’s one of those things that’s out there on the horizon that will happen when it’s a completely doable thing or the US forces other countries into it talk to me a little bit about the Yen I know you had a whole um article on this on your substack John um how far can the Yen fall before Japanese uh before Japan goes bankrupt pardon uh you say the bank of Japan will then face an impossible Choice support the Yen with even higher interest rates and watch government interests expense rise to National bankruptcy levels or or push interest rates down to keep a lid on Deb cost and cause the yen to collapse uh how much trouble is Japan in oh Japan’s in an unfixable spot and the question more is timing now than anything else because basically they they had their big Financial bubble in the 1990s ahead of everybody else you know before the tech stock bubble they had a real estate bubble it burst it was going to bankrupt um zombie real estate companies across the country and in instead of letting that happen which would have solved the problem in two hard years they decided to support all of those companies with massive new government spending programs and they’ve been had it ever since you know the uh the government debt in Japan on a per capita basis is higher than it’s been in any country in human history and it’s still growing and so what they’ve done is they’ve pushed their interest rates down to for a long time their interest rates were negative which made it very easy to handle um you know a big government debt because they actually paid for borrowing so they it was a cash flow positive process but now their interest rate because their inflation is picking up their interest rates are starting to rise and as their interest rates rise the government’s debt costs are starting to go up parabolically and at some point the uh the Japanese government is going to be paying more in interest than it’s going to be taking in in tax revenues and that’s basically a death spiral point for a country there and and Japan is heading in that direction and they don’t have any fix because if they um you know if they try to fix the falling Yen the yen is starting to fall in kind of a disorderly way now they have to do that with higher interest rates so they can stop the end from falling by raising interest rates but then they’ll bankrupt their government with those higher interest rates so uh there’s nothing they can really do about this in the longer run you know in the short run they could fiddle around but in the long run the current trends that are in place are going to kill the currency and bankrupt the government so so Japan might be a glimpse of our future our intermediate term future because we’re headed in the same direction it almost beat me to my next question I was going to say you know when I speak to uh you know investors in North America there seems to be a disconnect of well why you know okay the yen is is collapsing how does it affect my life but you just uh hinted as to why right there yeah um um interest costs reach a point where they eat up so much government spending that the government can’t take care of its citizens anymore and can’t deal with crises anymore because all their money is going to pay interest on the debt um that’s a broken country and then everybody who’s depending on the government suffers so you know basically the people who are hurt by this and this is a really despicable part of the whole fiat currency system and the um you know debt-ridden societies that it has created is the people who are hurt by the inevitable results of this process are the ones who trust the government you know if you hold on to um a big bank account denominated in your country’s currency or you keep a bunch of cash under the mattress or you own bond funds which is U what financial planners will tell you the safe thing to own is um you’re the one who’s hurt when the currency inevitably collapse collapses from excessive debt and excessive money creation so that’s what we’re doing now we’re going to wipe out the savings of a huge chunk of the American population and uh and that’s going to be brutal because they’re the ones who don’t deserve to be hurt that is such a strong statement John the more trusting you are the more you’ll get burned I mean I know that can apply to everything in life but um that’s some statement right there yeah it shouldn’t you shouldn’t be punished for trusting your government you know that’s that’s the kind of thing that um that destroys the um the the trust of a whole generation and it’s happened a lot in the past countries destroy their currencies all the time you uh you you see this happening over and over again where a country starts to borrow too much money um the debt starts to be a problem so they start to debase their currency that leads to a disorderly decline in the value of the currency then a hyperinflation um happened in um the late 1700s in France they had a hyperinflation and then they got Napoleon and a whole generation of European wars happened in Germany in the 1920s uh they had a hyperinflation and then they got Hitler um and that’s because when you wipe out a whole generation savings that generation uh is willing to accept pretty much anything politically as long as the people in charge promise to stop pleading so you get uh a willingness to accept a dictatorship or at least an authoritarian government and again you’re seeing signs of that here right all of a sudden we’re we’re voting for strong leaders who are willing to throw the the Constitution overboard in order to fix what people perceive to be unfixable problems so um that’s the the later stage of the process but the the currency collapse part of this comes first um and then comes uh political chaos and I’m afraid we’re heading in that direction John um talk to me about gold now I know you had another uh piece on gold porn part one gold bu gold bugs are suddenly cool uh talk to me a little bit about your thoughts uh in this new gold era uh it’s fun to be in Gold what are you telling uh folks who don’t own gold yet and are saying well is it too high for me to get in and what do you tell folks who maybe own some gold that are thinking do I sell it at these prices talk to me about gold okay gold is the form of money that has held its value for 3,000 years um and it’s the uh the money that people jump back into when their country tries a different kind of money and that money fails so we’re going through that part of the process right now and and you know again lots of historical precedent for this the Roman Empire had a high PR inflation when their copper coins were debased away U but gold held its value through the whole process so if you were in Gold you were fine golden Farmland in the Roman Empire during their hyperinflation uh made you rich uh that sort of thing has happened over and over again throughout human history and we’re back in that place again where uh we’re ruining our Count’s currencies and that’s Europe and Japan and maybe China and definitely Great Britain uh and the people that used to trust their country’s currencies are looking around for Alternatives and one of the things they’re finding is the one that people always find in situations like this is gold so they’re they’re going back into gold U because that’s a neutral asset it’s trust trustworthy it’ll hold its value for a really long time um and you’re seeing gold’s price go up because of that countries are buying gold because they no longer trust the US dollar as the reserve asset and individuals are buying gold um because they’re worried about inflation they’re seeing the their cost of living go up and they want something that protects them from that and they’re seeing people on online like us talk about this how gold will protect you if inflation really starts to pick up and so you’re seeing Rising demand um for individuals now you probably saw what happened with Costco just lately where um they they started offering gold and now they’re selling $200 million a month of of gold coins which is a couple billion dollars a year from a brand new source something that didn’t exist two years ago um so Chinese gold buying didn’t exist 10 years ago and they’re now buying gold on a massive scale uh and on the individual scale um Costco is an example of people buying gold is kind of an Impulse buy right they they’re at the checkout line and they see the flyer for gold on the uh the checkout counter there and they say okay to toss a gold coin in my in my cart now too and that’s the kind of thing that uh that you see happen normally and it’s the kind of thing that should be happening people should be figuring out by now that they can’t trust the dollar to protect their purchasing power because in 1920 or in 2022 they um they lost almost 10% of their purchasing power in one year so people have seen it happen they know it’s possible and they see it coming on a bigger scale uh and so they’re buying gold and lately silver too so and I think that’s what you should be doing you know that’s one of the quick and easy ways to protect yourself from instability in the financial markets you just go to money that’s going to hold its value for a really long time and just hunker down you know and so the the question is not should you be buying gold you absolutely should the question is in what form and how you should be storing it and that’s that’s a that’s a subject for an hourong show sometime because it’s it’s complicated and and it’s interesting just one more point because I think this this is important when you say but do not touch your core physical gold SLS silver this is your Bedrock generational wealth and should be immune to Market fluctuations for perspective Envision it saving your grandkids lives someday yeah um when you’re shifting your financial life from um Financial assets like cash and Bank stocks and things like that you want to start start with physical gold and silver that’s under your control that’s accessible in some way again that’s a complicated subject but basically let’s let’s assume for instance that you know how to store and hide it and everything and who to tell about it and all of those things but you do that first with the um the intention of ideally never selling it let it be your generational wealth that uh that you pass down to your kids and they pass to their kids because it it protects you against extreme Dream Events that’s it’s kind of insurance against governments doing crazy things and that that are beyond your control so you do that once you’ve got that kind of Bedrock um gold and silver real money basis for your financial life then you can Branch out into other kinds of real assets like oil stocks or gold and silver miners or ETFs that buy physical gold and silver and store it in vaults for you or remotely stored precious metals like um you know set up an account in Switzerland and have them store some gold bars for you you know we’re talking about in this case people with a lot of capital but to the extent that you can do that that is the way to protect yourself from what’s probably coming John so for just segue here for firsttime home buy buyers do you even think about buying a home in this environment this is probably the worst time to buy a house in in our lifetimes and there have been some bad times in the past so that’s saying something but yeah how house prices houses got unaffordable expensive three or four years ago and even if you got yourself a a 3% mortgage or something like that the average house was still out of your out of your reach if you were the average buyer but in that time so let’s say house prices have stayed the same over the last three years well mortgage rates have more than doubled so if you’re going to buy the same house that you would have bought um three years ago say half a million dollars um but today you’re going to buy that house with a current mortgage your monthly payments are double what they would have been back in um three years ago even though it was very expensive back then so that’s why the housing market is kind of Frozen there are all these people who are stuck in houses with 3% mortgages where are they going to go you know if they sell their house and they have to take out a new mortgage um the price will be yeah so so the housing market is kind of Frozen very there’s not very many sales going on even as inventory is starting to go up and so what that usually um portends is a big crack in prices you know when when more and more houses are for sale but fewer and fewer houses are actually selling prices have to come down and I think we’re headed for that we’re we’re going to see a um depending on your your point of view a catastrophic or a really nice drop in house prices um and at at some point in the cyle houses are going to be cheap again and interest rates will go lower and that’ll be the time to buy in but this is absolutely not that time now for most people so hang tight on the housing front guys um John I absolutely love this conversation we need to bring you back um ASAP but just to wrap you’ve been in this market um you know at least since the start of since the launch of your book which was over 20 years ago um have you ever seen a time like this um th this is an extreme version of the times that we have gone through in the last 20 years so not exactly like this and although Daniel I I’ll bet a lot of your guests in the past have said something like Daniela you’re you’re too young to remember the 1970s but trust me heading back into something like that and and I think you could use the 1970s as kind of a template for what’s coming so we you know we have kind of lived through times like this but um not nearly as serious back in the 1970s inflation started to pick up government spending was growing government debt was Rising uh inflation was rising and we had civil unrest and there were wars in the Middle East so it was very similar in a lot of ways uh and what ended up happening there is that interest rates spiked um inflation spiked gold and silver just went through the roof and to fix it back then we had to raise interest rates to like 18% which uh the the reason it’s different today is we cannot do that today because we’re so deeply indebted that if we raise interest rates even a little bit from where they are right now we bankrupt huge sections of of American society and then we go into something like the 1930s you know deflation depression so we can’t we don’t have the tool that we used to fix things back then um which takes us back to the FED being in a box that it can’t get out of we don’t have the tools anymore to fix the kind of Crisis that we’re creating so who knows what happens when it finally starts biting and correct me if I’m wrong John there’s also not the sense of community that I’m sure existed in the 70s that is not present today well we were even to to to get through those times right to have a support group yeah we’re we’re a lot more um diffus than we used to be you know people lived closer to home in the 1970s than they do now we move away and you get three generations in three different houses and um yeah it yeah I mean but we were still kind of a fragmented Society back in the 70s we had the Civil Rights um movement and we had the Vietnam War protests and so we had unpopular War we had um college campuses just inflamed and you know in in in other words we we had things like we we’re seeing now and they led to what ended up being a major financial crisis so yeah I think probably the lesson we’ll learn from this if we survive it intact right is that we need to go back to almost 1950s perspectives where we uh where we have neighbors that we know and we can trust and we take care of our families and and um things like that you know we we have backyard gardens where we grow some of our own food thing things that we we’ve kind of drifted out of but we’re very healthy lifestyle choices we need to go back to that exactly Amen to that John Rubino like I said love having you on come back soon let’s not wait 20 years um John Rubino they can read a more from you on substack thank you so much thanks Daniela great talking to you and I always invite uh listeners to book a calendly appointment I know we talk gold silver monetary policy we can help you build a strategy uh around this and prepare yourself for everything that John uh is warning could happen so book a account the appointment with one of my wonderful colleagues over at itm trading it’s a free session it’s inform ative it’s entertaining you’ll laugh you might cry but it will be healthy so do it you could do that in the link below and we’ll see you soon don’t forget to sign up at danela com.com to stay on top of all these incredible interviews I love having guests like John Rubino on and I love you my audience thank you for watching we’ll see you soon [Music]

John Rubino, former Wall Street financial analyst, author, and founder of DollarCollapse.com, sounds a stark warning: ‘People who are hurt by the inevitable results of this process are the ones who trust the government.’ In his sobering analysis, he outlines a bleak future for the U.S. economy, where mounting debt and escalating interest costs cripple the government’s ability to provide for its citizens. The repercussions? A widespread suffering for those dependent on government aid. Rubino points to Japan’s struggle with a plummeting yen and soaring interest rates as a cautionary tale of the perils of unchecked debt. In the face of such financial uncertainty, he urges individuals to safeguard their assets by investing in gold and silver.

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📖 CHAPTERS:
00:00 Dollar collapse
4:00 U.S. dollar reserve currency
6:22 Economic repercussions
9:59 Gold reserves
13:54 China gold purchase
15:44 Japan’s trouble
18:04 Consequences of trusting the government
21:31 Gold
27:18 Housing purchasing
29:09 Concluding words

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